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archive.

@sabineswren-archive / sabineswren-archive.tumblr.com

blog irrelevant. new blog found ->
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A fresh start was needed, so I’ve remade my blog. As such, this blog is now an archive. Feel free to follow on the new blog, but please don’t feel pressured to! I’ll be putting this in my queue a few times to keep it posted, but this will be the last post made.

(also, feel free to unfollow this blog, too, I don’t mind!)

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aphony-cree
Anonymous asked:

Do you think it's just a coincidence that the Supernatural fandom hasn't embraced very many female characters, but the ones they have have no possibility for a romantic interest for either of the boys? (People love Charlie, who's a lesbian, and the boys won't fall for her. People love Jody Mills and Ellen who both are more like take-no-shit, mothers for the boys)

I know it’s not a coincidence. Hatred against female characters has mellowed over the past few years but in the early seasons fans made it pretty clear that the hatred was linked to a perceived sexual threat. When it was leaked that two females (Bela and Ruby) would be joining the cast in season 3 fans immediately started campaigns to get rid of them, even though all they knew about them was their gender. The hatred against Bela and Ruby continued during the season until it was revealed that Ruby was a demon, then fans embraced Ruby but continued hating on Bela. I saw a number of posts on fan boards saying “The Winchesters would never have sex with a demon.” Fans did not perceive demons as a sexual threat and there was actually a good amount of positivity toward Ruby for a while. In season 4 they revealed that Sam and Ruby were in a relationship and I saw fans turn on her again. 

Things are better now but this attitude is still present. I didn’t see one negative thing about Hannah until the season 10 preview suggested she may have been developing feelings for Cas. After that, Hannah hate started popping up on my dash and I saw people calling for the character to be killed. When confronted, I saw some of them use the excuse “I never liked her, she’s boring, this has nothing to do with Cas.” It may be true that they always found the character boring, but they didn’t chose to campaign for that character’s death until it was suggested she’d have feelings for a male lead.

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As someone who didn’t like Hannah, to be fair, a lot of us that didn’t like her from the beginning felt that way because of her qualities as a person (I personally had beef with her being so fickle in her loyalties), not because we thought she’d be a sexual threat. Sure, I didn’t like the idea of her with Cas, but that’s because I see the Angels as family and it felt gross to have them hook up.  It had nothing to do with her being a partner for Cas, period.

I would 100% agree that some of the Hannah-hate you saw was because of people hating on the idea of her as a love interest for Cas, but I think the increase in Hannah-hate you saw at the start of season 10 was also because she was going to be given a bigger role which some of us weren’t happy about given that we already didn’t like her character.

Everyone fawns all over Charlie because they think it’s so cool that she’s nerdy and sweet, but I’d be willing to bet that if she had the exact same personality but were straight and a love interest, fans would be going out of their way to hate her.

And also, I actually was hoping for Hannah to be written off from the beginning.  I just don’t campaign for that shit.  (To be honest, I was so conflicted about wanting Hannah gone, because I couldn’t stand her character but I really liked Erica.  She’s funny!)

As I said, I’m sure there are people who didn’t like Hannah’s character from the start (not everyone is going to like every character) but I didn’t see any hatred posts until the season 10 preview was released. It’s fine to not enjoy a character but the fact of the matter is most people kept quiet about that opinion until a romance dynamic was added to her, as if making her a romantic interest gave them permission to publicly hate her. People posting “Kill Hannah!” in response to the season 10 preview (which I saw many times) is not the same as you saying why you personally disliked the character. There is vitriol and violence behind someone saying “Kill Hannah!” and that’s something I’ve seen aimed at many female characters.   When Carver did a pre-season 10 interview and said demon!Dean would have a fling with a waitress I saw posts calling for her death. We didn’t even know Ann Marie’s name yet and there were popular posts going around that said “By fling they better mean Dean flings her out a window.” Fans celebrated the idea of her dying when all they knew about her was that she’d be having sex with Dean. Season 10 also introduced Cole, a male character that much of the fandom dislikes. When fans talk about why they dislike Cole they always detail their reasons for disliking him, much like you detailed your dislike of Hannah, they don’t simply add “Kill Cole!” to every gifset involving him. For male characters, fans always give a reason for disliking them and they rarely call for their deaths, most of what I see says “They need to drop that character” or “I hope he gets written off soon.” When a female character is hated I see a lot of posts calling for their death and I very rarely see people give a reason for disliking her.

Brother and sister is how community members referred to each other in biblical times, in fact this tradition didn’t die out until a couple centuries ago. In the Bible, there are numerous passages that refer to “my brother” when a person is not talking about a genetic brother but a member of their community. Watch a historically accurate movie about the pilgrims and they’ll be referring to each other as brother and sister too. Many religious communities still refer to each other as brother and sister. This is why the angels do it. Supernatural established in season 5 that angels do not consider all other angels as siblings

Dean:  You mean to tell me you’ve never been up there doing a little cloud-seeding? Castiel:  I’ve never had occasion, okay? -Free to Be You and Me 5.03

When Dean asked if Cas had ever had sex with anyone in heaven he didn’t say that angels don’t have sex, or “gross, we’e related,” he simply said he personally had never done it. If angel on angel action was considered incest Cas certainly would have said so at the time, the Winchesters always point it out when Wincest is brought up in canon. Michael talked about raising Lucifer and the archangels seemed to consider each other siblings, it’s possible that most angels view their garrison the same way, but there are a lot of garrisons which means a lot of angels that they don’t view as siblings. Angels can be sexual, Balthazar certainly was, but there is a rule against angels having sex with humans. This means that sexual angels who follow the rules have sex with other angels. I was very surprised that the fandom used an incest argument against the Cas/Hannah story-line when angel on angel sex was talked about so early in the angelic story-line. It’s been long established that the angels are a community, and like in biblical times their community is their family, but they are not genetic siblings and can inter-mingle. 

I agree that if Charlie were straight there would probably be more resistance toward her, even if she were only portrayed as a platonic friend. I think a clear indicator that fans view Charlie differently than heterosexual female characters is that I’ve seen many fans claim Charlie is the only female character to never have a romantic story-line. She had a romantic interest in her second episode, LARP and the Real Girl 8.11, then spent much of Slumber Party 8.11 flirting with Dorothy and ran away with her. So why do so many fans claim she’s the only female to never have a romantic story-line? Is it just because she’s never been romantically linked to a male character?

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