Aerith’s Lover and Friend: Someone she loves eternally and will always protect. Their bond transcends time.

Artist:  rueme.deviantart.com

Source: Pinterest.com 

His Earth, Her Sky. His Moon, Her Night. Her Sun. His Moon. His Princess. Her Knight.

Artist: MMDKasumi2140

Beautifully done!

So Square Enix has asked websites to not use certain images of a certain scene involving a certain heroine… and on one hand I want to respect that, but… that would take away a lot of content.

Do they really think people don’t know about her fate? It’s been 20 years and its been discussed thousands of times. 

Is there really any point?

Theu’ve just hoping for more people to play the game who never did before.

My first contribution to the wonderful Clerith fandom. I’ve been stalking the tag for a while but I never contributed in anything so here is my first Clerith art. I shipped them since the beginning and their love story just break my heart in many pieces.

Welcome! Your art is lovely..

Official Quotes for Clerith [3/?]

Official Quotes for Clerith [4/?]

Destined Lovers

“It was the sound of Cloud’s heart cracking. It was the cry of his heart that could never be healed of the grief he had towards Aerith’s death, the blame towards himself and the hatred he had for Sephiroth…There was nothing she could do about Cloud’s suffering and the pain ached in her heart.” ~Maiden of the Planet, Square Enix  (Cloud’s heart broke when Aerith died.)

When Cloud lost the love of his life, his heart shattered. There would be no other woman like her ever again. 

No other could fill the missing void his heart cherished and lost. 

See their tragic love story unfold once again in the Final Fantasy VII: Remake: 

1. Aerith gives off a Mother Earth vibe because she saved the Planet from destruction in FFVII. She also healed all citizens of the Planet from Geostigma in AC/ACC using a combination of the Lifestream (the life force of the Planet) plus rain water

2. Aerith has these abilities because she is part Cetra. The Cetra are able to commune with the planet. She is not human.

3. Cloud is also not human. He has been injected with the cells of Jenova and inundated with high levels of Mako (the Lifestream), which affect his perception of the world and gives him superhuman abilities.

4. Cloud’s bond to Aerith is due to the high levels of Mako (Lifestream) in him. Since Aerith is able to commune with the Lifesteram, she is also able to commune with Cloud due to the high levels of Mako in him. Nomura has even said that Aerith lives on inside of Cloud because of this. .Here’s a link to that interview: 

http://i.imgur.com/JGGnu0c.gifv

The following is a screenshot:

That interview can be seen on the Advent Children DVD. It says this:

A detailed explanation can be found in this post: Aerith is Dead…

5. When Nomura says that Aerith lives on inside of Cloud, he means that Cloud and Aerith’s spirits are joined by the Lifestream in an eternal bond as soulmates.  A detailed explanation is in this post: Aerith is Dead….

6. Aerith specifically says in the Maiden Who Travelled the Planet (an official novella released by SE) that Aerith loves Cloud more than Zack:

Aerith was in even greater pain when she thought about Cloud. She also had good feelings towards him. At first, she thought he somehow had some similarities to her first love. Even so, his looks, voice and personality weren’t similar and he also made her think of him as a mysterious person… But it soon didn’t matter. She loved him much more than her first love. Cloud was her hero and he couldn’t get away from danger. She saw him as someone full of confidence, cool and had the impression that he would disappear in an instant if she took her eyes off him. She wanted to stay by his side forever if she could. She really wanted to.

7. Aerith and Zadk being together in the Lifestream means nothing because Jessie, Biggs, and Wedge are also together in the Lifestream and they are just friends.

8. When Cloud says, “I’m not alone… mot anymore” and smiles at the end of AC/AC, he means that he is no longer alone because he has found Aerith again. He has felt alone without her for the last two years, but he no longer feels alone now because he found her again in AC/ACC. This is explained in more detail at the following post:  Aerith is Dead….

Other interpretations are possible, but the Clerith viewpoint is fully backed by quotes from the creators, the gamelore of FFVII and the script of the game.

1. Ok

2. She is human. Humans are just cetra who lost the ability to speak to the planet and all that jazz.

3. Cloud despite being enhanced is still human. I have no clue why you are saying him and Aerith are not human.

4. How is Aerith able to commune with everyone else then? And Aerith does not literally live inside of Cloud. Just stop it. For your own sake.

5. Did you hurt yourself making that logical leap? Nomura says nothing of the sort. And you would think this would be kind of a big deal if Aerith was literally fused to Clouds soul. Strange how the last we see of her she is leaving with Zack. Shouldn’t she be leaping into Cloud?

6. I don’t care about Maiden. Benny does not write the story of FFVII.

7. Why don’t we see them then? Surly ACC could have included them right?

8. Cloud smiled before seeing Aerith AND ZACK. He smiled at the children. He returned a shy smile to Tifa. He was alone for a short time during and before the movie in self imposed exile. You have zero support for this 2 years nonsense.

In fact let’s post that ACC story playback shall we?

Funny how this paints a vividly different picture from the “clerith perspective”.

Cloud surrounded by friends and family forgives himself and he realizes where he is meant to live. And since he is no longer suffering in loneliness Aerith and Zack LEAVE. Nothing in there about “finding Aerith”. Also strange how it’s Aerith AND Zack every time they are mentioned. While Tifa Marlene and Denzel are separated out as his family.

The quote Jeffe posted, there’s an additional line to it that state Aerith and Zack go back to the lifestream. 

There’s several lines that say Zack and Aerith are from the lifestream. Not from within Cloud or back to Cloud.The full thing Nomura is saying is that if we remember someone they are not truly gone, not that Aerith literally is INSIDE of Cloud. 

I have the full interview of the making of Advent Children. It’s not literal of Aerith being inside of him, but rather that those who have died (in general) live on inside of us because we carry their memories. 

Okay, I was in the middle of answering this question when I left off yesterday.  I was still commenting on what Bugenhagen had to say in Como Canyon, so refer back to his dialogue in my last post.

========================

I HAVE TO CLARIFY SOMETHING HERE

Enoigmaphenomenon just messaged me and said that she posted this to Jaffe, not to me. So I am answering the wrong questions - sorry, Eni. I’m going to answer them anyway, though, just to clarify the points I’ve made. Thanks for contacting, me, Eni! *hugs*

Anyway, I think I left off here, talking about Bugenhagen’s comments in Cosmo Canyon (see )my last post for the dialogue)

As I said yesterday:

1. Bugenhagen clearly says that souls roman the Planet and that they are part of the Planet.  He also says that spirits roam, converge, and divide. That means there’s no one place for the spirits to be. The souls are part of the Planet. That means Aerith’s soul can be anywhere she wants to be.

2. Nojima says in CoL White that Aerith is a Cetra and that she chose not to return to the Planet at that time. The Cetra spirts at the Temple of Ancients also told Aerith that they had chosen not to return to the Planet for hundreds of years by their own chioce so that they could guard the Black Materia. Since Aerith is a Cetra, this shows that Aerith is able to choose where her spirit goes.

3. Bugenhagen clearly says that the Lifesteramm is part of life on the Planet and that it exists within nature. Therefore, the Lifestrean can be found within all living things. He also says that spirits roam converge and divide in the Lkfestream, which means that they travel and roam the Planet within the Lfestream. This means that Aerith is able to be anywhere the Lifestream is.

Since Cloud has an extraneous amount of Mako (Lifestream) in him - not only was it infused into him by Hojo, but he received a “double dose” of it while submerged in the Lifestream for about 10 days before resurfacing in Mideel - there is more than enough Lifestream in his body for Aerith’ spirit to reside there. 

4. Notice too that Bugenhagen says there are exceptions:

Bugenhagen         "'Spirit Energy' is a word that you should never forget."         "A new life... children are blessed with Spirit energy and are brought into the world."         "Then, the time comes with they die and once again return to the Planet..."         "Of course there are exceptions, but this is the way of the world."         "I've digressed, but you'll understand better if you watch this." (FMV sequence. The camera zooms in on model Earth. We see trees and humans being born, then die. Their bodies becomes masses of swirling light, then streak across the surface of the Earth, merging. O

If there are exceptions, then you can’t say that Aerith’s spirit and consciousness living inside of Cloud is impossible. It may be impossible on Planet Earth, but the principles of life and death are different on planet Gaia than they are on Earth. After all, Sephiroth was dead thoughout the events of Disk 1, 2, and 3. That couldn’t happen on Earth.

Now, you asked about why we don’t see Aerith ;popping back into Cloud intead of leaving with Zack at the end of the movie:

No that’s not the idea at all. If she is bonded to Cloud’s soul, then that bond will remain wherever Aerith goes. 

Think of it in terms of two people who are in love. Have you ever heard a man or woman say that their heart is always with their love? Does that mean they have to be together for that bond to exist? No. It means their heart is with their love no matter whether they are in the sane location or far apart.

That’s the kind of bond I’m talking about here. Aerith’s heart is with Cloud and Cloud;s heart is with Aerith regardless of whether they are far apart or near one another. Their souls are bonded, so they are always with each other regardless of any physical distance. A bonding of the souls has nothing to do with physical proximity.

In the sane vein, why does Aerith returning to the Lifestrean with Zack ean that she’s in love with Zack? Jessie, Biggs, and Wedge are also in the Lifestream together but they are just friends. The same could be true for Zack and Aerith.

Then why do you believe anything in the Ultimania’s? Maiden Who Travels the Planet was published by SE in the FFVII Ultimania Omega. If you consider other information in that Ultinania to be official, then you have to consider all parts of it to be official. If you find the story published in it to be questionable, then the rest of the information in that book is also questionable.

Besides as i said before, the story and script of FFVII was written as a staff collaboration. It wasn’t written by any single author. Nojima himself said so in the following interview:

So you can’t say that any one staff member was involved in writing the story or script, Multiple staff were involved and it was a collaborative effort.

You mean Cloud and Aerith? IMO, Cloud and Aerith were included in both AC and ACC. If anything, I felt that AC and ACC both were strongly pro-Clerith and pretty much defeated any idea of Cloti. To state it blatantly,I personally felt that both AC and ACC canonized Clerith and I know many other Clerith people who feel the same way.

You see it differently. Fine. Nomura even said in the AC prologue that more than ne interpretation is possible:

Just don’t try to tell me that there’s only one correct way to interpret the movie because Nomura clearly says right here that there is NOT only one way to interpret it.

Now you’er relying on interpretation only. IMO, Cloud didn’t return Tifa’s smile at all. Other Clerith ;people I’ve spoken to don’t see Cloud smile at Tiga, either - her smile to him is more than obvious, but none of us see him smiling at her. This is all we see:

IMO that’s a brush off… not a smile.

Now you say the movie alone imposed exile on Cloud. Again, you’re ibasing your judgments on physical proximity. At the end of the movie Cloud says, 

“I’m not alone…. not anymore”

Whether Cloud’s talking about being alone or feeling alone are two different things. It’s pure interpretation. You say he wasn’t alone while living with Tifa and the kids, but I say he FELT alone without Aerith even while living with Tifa and the kids.

You don’t see it that way because you think Cloud’s in love with Tifa. I don’t think he’s in love with Tifa. I see absolutely ZERO indication of romantic feelings from Cloud to Tifa anywhere in AC or ACC. Neither do other Cleriths. The ONLY romance I see going on in AC/ACC is between Cloud and Aerith.

Clerith people do not see the HW scene as romantic. We never have. The bit about sharing mutual feelings means to us that they shared mutual feelings of strong friendship, and that’s it. That’s backed up by the FACT that the ;picture of the HW scene shown on the FTOIL page is of the next morning, not the night before. Look at the picture:

That’s a picture of the next morning when Tifa asked to rest her head on Cloud’s shoulder a little longer.THAT’s when the mutual feelings are shared without words, Sharing mutual feelings without words does not refer to them having sex. The mutual feelings without words that they shared are the feelings they shared when Tifa rests her head on Cloud’s shoulder a little longer the next morning. That’s what the picture shows on the FTOIL page.

And those feelings are verbalized by Cloud the next morning. He says this:’

Those feelings can be taken both romantically and platonically. So when Nojima says that he knew that Cloud and Tifa would be together in AC/ACC, he’s referring to the mutual feelings they expressed here. Those feelings are not decisively romantic - they can be taken as platonic feelings of close friendship, too.

As for the family Tifa says this in Case of Tifa:

source: FFVII Citadel

So the family does not indicate romance. The family indicates a close friendship.

There is no indication that Cloud and Tifa sleep together. That is left up to the viewer’s imagination. We are never shown that they share a bedroom. Sure, it’s possible that they have sex even if they don’t share a bedroom, but it’s equally possible that they don’t have sex. Once again, it’s left up to the viewer’s imagination.

If you remember, Cid and Shera lived together for years without being romantically involved before and during FFVII. Things changed between them AFTER FFVII, but they lived together for years in the same house before and during FFVII for years with no romantic involvement at all. Jessie, Biggs, Wedge, Tifa, and Barret also lived together for years in the same house with no romantic involvement. Slo living inthe same house does not automatically mean that they are romantically involved.

It’s all up to interpretation, just like Nomura said in the AC prologue..It’s possible to interpret the evidence as Clerith just as easily as it is to interpret the evidence as Cloti.

As I said before I personally see the evidence as pointing to a Clerith romance. IMO, FFVII and AC/ACC are both blatantly Clerith. You see it differently. Fine. I’ve seen all of your evidence and I’m not convinced by it.Your free to have a different opinion, but my own interpretation of the LTD is that Cloud’s true love is Aerith.

Alright.

That is immediately followed with.

Well which is it? Is she living in Cloud’s mako infused body or not? Because we are shown that while Aerith can move about the lifestream. She is still in one place at a time. She can’t be soul fused with Cloud while being away from him.

As for Benny and Maiden? Why do clerith shippers have a hard time understanding that there is a difference between a guidebook and writing story elements? It really doesn’t matter that Maiden was thrown in a guidebook as an extra. It’s meaningless. As are those diary entries. They exist in the Bennyverse of FFVII. Nowhere else.

No I mean Biggs, wedge and Jessie. If you want to compare Zack to those 3 then why didn’t they show up? Or anyone else for that matter? Because Zack is not special right?

And you people wonder why over the years so many people have made fun of clerith? I mean it’s not enough that it takes all of 2 screen shots to prove that Cloud smiles at Tifa. It’s even in the script.

It really calls in to question everything you say when you can’t even admit Cloud smiles at Tifa.

Just like you don’t see Cloud smile at Tifa?

You also once believed there were 3 versions of the Highwind scene. “The one where Cloud outright rejects Tifa” So there is that.

Except they are talking there…..

Also I am not sure how they are supposed to show of picture of this mutual romantic confirmation ‘without words’ when it happens in a fade to black.

So Tifa is worried about her close friendship with Cloud, Marlene and Denzel throughout CoT and AC? When the AC playback, the Turks novel, Nojima and Nomura interviews and Case of Barret among others separates those 3 and later 4 out as family separate from their friends that is simply talking about a different group of friends?

Seems a rather odd way to go about it for SE.

So after getting over his emotional issues Cid gets married to Shera who is devoted to him? Seems familiar. And he even compares his relationship to Cloud and Tifa when he mention it’s the women who wear the points?

Also I’m not sure how you can compare Cid/Sheras situation to AVALANCHE. Or Avalanche to Cloud and Tifa in CoT and beyond. C/S is in a strange sexual tension situation pre FFV. Avalanche are a terrorist group living in a bar. Cloud and Tifa live alone and adopt.

thecallmeeljeffe

There is no contradiction there between the two paragraphs due to the nature of the Lifesream. You only think there’s a contradiction because you’re thinking that souls have a physical limitation so that they can only be in one spot at one time. That’s only true of a human body. It’s not true of the Lifestream or a sou of the Lifestream unless the soul manifests physically. If a soul manifests physically, then it’s like Sephiroth fighting Cloud or Aerith boosting Cloud up to fight Bahamut, 

Bugenhagen made it clear that souls of the Lifestream are not limited to one physical location when he said that the Lifesream roams, converges, and divides. Bugenhagen also said that the Lifesream exists in nature. Bugenhagen also said that the Lifestream is part of all living things. That was all quoted in the last post you responded to. 

Souls of the Lifestream have the sane capability - they do not have to be in only one place all the time because the Lifestream is in all things. A soul of the Lifestream can go anywhere the Lifestream is. They do not have the same physical limitations as a human being because they are part of a greater element that exists everywhere

What Nomura was talking about has no physical limitation for that reason. Besides, Nomura said that Aerith’s consciousness lives on inside of Cloud, and the soul is differentiated from the consciousness in AC/ACC. We see it here, for example:

In this quote, Rufus talks about Sephiroth’s mind being dissolving into the Lifestream, not his body. Sephiroth’s mind would be the same as Sephiroth’s consciousness. 

Nomura makes a similar differentiation between in the quote I gave you before:

So if Sephiroth’s mind or consciousness cab dissolve into the Lifestream as Rusus suggested, then Aerith;s consciousness can dissolve into the immense amount of Lifestream present in Cloud’s body. People still had Geostigma even while Sephiroth fought Cloud in AC/ACC. So even though Sephiroth’s mind had dissolved into the Lifestream, his presence was still able to fight Cloud and his mind was still able to talk to Cloud.

Notice, too, that Nomura says this during the Distance interview that I quoted above::

The end of the game included the hand reach scene and Cloud saying, “i think I can meet her…. there.”

Not only was the hand reach scene reenacted during the movie with Cloud and Aerith actually taking one another;s hand (which didn’t happen in the game), but Cloud says at the end of the movie that he is no longer alone. He said, “I think I can meet her…. there”: in the original game. So “i’m not alone… not anymore” could easily be referring to Cloud’s line in the original game. He’s no longer alone because he met Aerith kin AC/ACC and her consciousness lives on inside him.

They are now bonded by the Lifestream, in the same way lovers might say that their heart is with their lover’s heart.

thecallmejeffe:

Biggs, Wedge. and Jessie DO show up in Maiden Who Travels the Planet, the story you refuse to accept as official. Did you know that Tres Dias, aka Squall of SEED, considers MoTP to be official? He even wrote an essay with Quexinos about how MoTP is official for my Clerth website. My website is currently down, but Qyexinos could easily provide confirmation of that for you. Quexinos, if you don’t now her, is also a Cloti. Just ask Enigmaphenomenon.

And of course Zack is special to both Cloud and Aerith. But does being special to Cloud mean that Cloud’s in love with Zack? No. So why does it have to mean that Aerith’s still in love with Zack?nbn

Barret is special to Tifa, too. Does that mean that Tifa’s in love with Barret?

thecallmejeffe:

No we wonder why you have to be rude when disagreeing with us. Have I been rude to you? Then why make statements like there’s reason to make fun of Cleriths? No need for it.

Here’s the sequence from this video

If you look at the time stamp in the lower left hand corner under each pic, you will see that the sequence is 3:20 (Tifa’s smile). 3:21 (Cloud’s reaction) 3:22 (Cloud puts his his head down)

I see no smile.

Which script are you talking about? Why didn’t you link to it? You have to purchase the official script from SE. If a website were to publish the official version, then they could be sued by SE  for copyright infringements.

thecallmejeffe:

I’ve never said that there are three versions of the HW scene. You have me confused with someone else.  So how reliable does that make you?

Do you even realize that more than one person has responded to you?

But in the LA version of the HW scene, Coud does not share mutual feelings with Tifa. SE even says so in the Final Fantasy VII Ultimania Omega:

SE also specifies that the only version where Cloud and Tifa share mutual feelings is in the High Affection version:

So even the FTOIL page makes it clear that two versions of the HW scene exist, and that the conversation where they share mutual feelings only happens when TIFA’s degree of affection is high.

Now look again at the quote. 

See the page number that quote is on? Page 232? Well, the picture of Cloud and Tifa on the FTOIL page actually directs you to the paragraph quoted above. If you look at the picture, you’ll see P. 232 in the upper right hand corner: 

The FTOIL page asks you to go to the quote above where it is specified that there are two possible conversations and that which conversation you get depends on Tifa’s affection rating. So even the FTOIL page makes it clear that two variations of the HW scene are possible by directing the reader to page 232.

thecallmejeffe

But they stop talking while Tife rests her head on his shoulder awhile longer. You can see it in the video here:

The HIghwind Scene

The scene where Tifa rests her head on Cloud’s shoulder starts at 19:32 If you ask me, it’s obvious that Tifa rests her head on Cloud’s shoulder all during the blackout, since her head is on Cloud’s shoulder before and after the blackout.

Well,, that’s the whole point. If SE wanted people to think the mutual feelings got portrayed in Scene 136 “Understanding” during the blackout, then all they had to do was show the scene right before the blackout:

But instead they showed this scene, which is from “Last morning”, scene 137. And the part where they share mutual feelings also takes place during a blackout:

So SE made it clear that the mutual feelings being shared without words takes place during Scene 137, not Scene 136. They did it by showing us what happens right before the blackout in Scene 137.

So no sex took place when they shared mutual feelings without words. All that happened was that Tifa rested her head on Cloud’s shoulder for awhile.

The FTOIL picture makes that a FACT.

thecallnejeffe:

You’ll have to give me the quotes before I know for sure which quotes you’re talking about from these books. 

But even without seeing those quotes, I can say that it doesn’t contradict what I said, I quoted Tifa as saying in CoT that her family is made up of friends. I said that means her family is based on friendship, not romance.

I didn’t say anything about their other friends. 

But you say they have other friends who aren’t part of the family. Yes, they do - so what? Did you want Tifa to say, “our family is made up of friends, but we have other friends, too?” What she says is clear enough:

I consider my brother to be my best friend, but I have other friends, too. My brother is part of my family, but I’m not romantically in love with him. Yet, he’s my best friend and part of my family. I have other friends, too, but they will never be ;part of my family.

So sorry, but what you said doesn’t argue against what I said.

thecallejeffe

Cid’s emotional issues had to do with Shera. Cloud’s emotional issues had to do with Aerith. Doesn’t sound comparable at all.

As for wearing the pants: let’s look at the whole quote

When Cid says that it’s the women who wear the pants, he’s talking about Tifa getting Clod to run a delivery service. Cid asks if Cloud’s running a business, and Barret says he’s running the business because Tifa kicked his ass into shape. Then Cid says it’s the women who wear the pants. So the reference to women wearing the pants is about how Tifa getting Cloud to start the delivery business. It has nothing to do with what their relationship is on a romantic level. If you think it says anything to do wiyh their relationship on a romantic level, then you’re just reading into it.

Now saying “So Clouds with Tifa” COULD mean that they’re in a romantic relationship, but it’s nothing definite. At the beginning of FFVI, I could say that Tifa was with Barret. Would that mean they were in a romantic relationship? No. it is not conclusive because it can be taken two ways.

What would be a confirmation for me would be a scene like this with Cloud and either Tifa or Aerith:

That to me is confirmation. SE knows how to do a love scene. When SE show us something lke this with Cloud and one of the two girls, then I will say that couple is canon. Until then, we’re just dancing around quotes.

The truth is that SE could have EASILY worked a scene like this into AC/ACC. Cloud could have kissed Tifa after arriving back hoe to Seventh Heaven. Cloud could have kissed Aerith before she went back into the Lifestream. SE could easily have done that for either or both sides, but they chose not to. Why?

INO, it’s because SE doesn’t want to end the Love Triangle. There are millions of fans who support Clerith and mIllions of fans who support Cloti. If SE were to solve the LTD with a scene like this, SE would estrange millions of fans. If SE did a scene like this for Cloti, they’d lose millions of Clerith fans. If SE showed a scene like this for Clerith, they’d lose millions of Cloti fans. It’s a deal breaker no matter which side they pick.’

So they tease us both with lines in the Ultimania - some quotes support Clerith, some support Cloti, and some support Zerith. Then all fans remain happy.

It’s a much better method for SE to keep making money and make everyone happy. And it’s exactly the strategy they are using.

1. Aerith gives off a Mother Earth vibe because she saved the Planet from destruction in FFVII. She also healed all citizens of the Planet from Geostigma in AC/ACC using a combination of the Lifestream (the life force of the Planet) plus rain water

2. Aerith has these abilities because she is part Cetra. The Cetra are able to commune with the planet. She is not human.

3. Cloud is also not human. He has been injected with the cells of Jenova and inundated with high levels of Mako (the Lifestream), which affect his perception of the world and gives him superhuman abilities.

4. Cloud’s bond to Aerith is due to the high levels of Mako (Lifestream) in him. Since Aerith is able to commune with the Lifesteram, she is also able to commune with Cloud due to the high levels of Mako in him. Nomura has even said that Aerith lives on inside of Cloud because of this. .Here’s a link to that interview: 

http://i.imgur.com/JGGnu0c.gifv

The following is a screenshot:

That interview can be seen on the Advent Children DVD. It says this:

A detailed explanation can be found in this post: Aerith is Dead…

5. When Nomura says that Aerith lives on inside of Cloud, he means that Cloud and Aerith’s spirits are joined by the Lifestream in an eternal bond as soulmates.  A detailed explanation is in this post: Aerith is Dead….

6. Aerith specifically says in the Maiden Who Travelled the Planet (an official novella released by SE) that Aerith loves Cloud more than Zack:

Aerith was in even greater pain when she thought about Cloud. She also had good feelings towards him. At first, she thought he somehow had some similarities to her first love. Even so, his looks, voice and personality weren’t similar and he also made her think of him as a mysterious person… But it soon didn’t matter. She loved him much more than her first love. Cloud was her hero and he couldn’t get away from danger. She saw him as someone full of confidence, cool and had the impression that he would disappear in an instant if she took her eyes off him. She wanted to stay by his side forever if she could. She really wanted to.

7. Aerith and Zadk being together in the Lifestream means nothing because Jessie, Biggs, and Wedge are also together in the Lifestream and they are just friends.

8. When Cloud says, “I’m not alone… mot anymore” and smiles at the end of AC/AC, he means that he is no longer alone because he has found Aerith again. He has felt alone without her for the last two years, but he no longer feels alone now because he found her again in AC/ACC. This is explained in more detail at the following post:  Aerith is Dead….

Other interpretations are possible, but the Clerith viewpoint is fully backed by quotes from the creators, the gamelore of FFVII and the script of the game.

1. Ok

2. She is human. Humans are just cetra who lost the ability to speak to the planet and all that jazz.

3. Cloud despite being enhanced is still human. I have no clue why you are saying him and Aerith are not human.

4. How is Aerith able to commune with everyone else then? And Aerith does not literally live inside of Cloud. Just stop it. For your own sake.

5. Did you hurt yourself making that logical leap? Nomura says nothing of the sort. And you would think this would be kind of a big deal if Aerith was literally fused to Clouds soul. Strange how the last we see of her she is leaving with Zack. Shouldn’t she be leaping into Cloud?

6. I don’t care about Maiden. Benny does not write the story of FFVII.

7. Why don’t we see them then? Surly ACC could have included them right?

8. Cloud smiled before seeing Aerith AND ZACK. He smiled at the children. He returned a shy smile to Tifa. He was alone for a short time during and before the movie in self imposed exile. You have zero support for this 2 years nonsense.

In fact let’s post that ACC story playback shall we?

Funny how this paints a vividly different picture from the “clerith perspective”.

Cloud surrounded by friends and family forgives himself and he realizes where he is meant to live. And since he is no longer suffering in loneliness Aerith and Zack LEAVE. Nothing in there about “finding Aerith”. Also strange how it’s Aerith AND Zack every time they are mentioned. While Tifa Marlene and Denzel are separated out as his family.

You mean it’s funny how my perspective is different than yours? And since I think differently from you, that means I’m wrong? Actually, Nomura has said that’s not what he\ intended:

A very similar statement to the first one was said by Nomura specifically in reference to the Love Triangle in an interview with Dorimaga magazine, which you can find here: reference to the Love Triangle in an interview with Dorimaga  magazine in November, 2005 (after the release of Advent Children):   

Click here to see English version

Click here to see Japanese version

If you read the credits of FFVII as well as the game manual, you will see that Nomura actually wrote the original story with Sakaguchi, so don’t think the story is really by Nojima and Kitase. In fact, Nojima even states that main aspects of the plot were determined by staff collaboration rather than by any specific staff member:

Furthermore, Nojima goes on to state that at the time the HW scene was written (by Katour, not Nojima), none of the staff thought the HW scene would be considered important:

Simple: If the creative staff of FFVII didn’t think that the HW scene would be considered important to viewers, then it’s obvious that they didn’t intend for it to be considered important.

What this boils down to is that Nomura has repeated on more than one occasion that there is no “correct” way to interpret what happened in AC/ACC, and that the FFVII Compilation is a product of staff collaboration where more than one answer is possible.

In more direct answer to some of your statements, you say that Aerith leaves with Zack. Well, if she indeed leaves, then why do we see her twice without Zack in Calling? If she has left, why is she in Calling?

Furthermore, Aerith specifically states in the official novella Maiden Who Travelled the Planet published by SE that she loves Cloud more than Zack.

You’re thinking in terms of a world like ours, not the world of fantasy and magic where FFVII takes place. You can’t weigh what happens In the FFVII Collaboration the same way you experience\ our world. If you had read the article I linked you to called Aerith is Dead…. You’d see that it is indeed possible for Aerith to live on inside of Cloud’s body due to the high levels of Mako (Lifestream) present in him. That is possible in the world of FFViI, even though it is not possible in our own world.

Are you aware that even Tres Dias believes that Cloud loves/loved Aerith? You can find his statement to that effect HERE. He does go on to say that Cloud moves on with Tifa, which I disagree with - I think that is totally optional myself. But I also think that the LTD is in fact unresolved.

Therefore, I will let you believe what you want about the LTD. But stop harassing people for what they believe - their opinion is every bit as valid as yours.

“You mean it’s funny how my perspective is different than yours? And since I think differently from you, that means I’m wrong?”

No, I think it is funny how you are wrong because you think differently than SE.

And there is a big difference between “hey what does the angel statue mean” and “Everything is interpretation”. If that were the case then there would be no guidebooks period. You would not have statements of fact from the creators.

Tell me please, WHY CLARIFY ANYTHING IF EVERYTHING IS INTERPRETATION? What is the point?

I’m sorry but “Nomura said one time that you can interpret certain things how you like if that is how you enjoy the movie” is a very shaky foundation to build an entire ship on. He has also said all the answers ARE there in the story. Not to mention the previously brought up guidebooks.

And “lots of people worked on FFVII” is not an argument. I’m not entirely sure why you brought it up. Possibly to pad out your post to make it look like you had more there there then was actually there?

As for “calling”? Why was that song and Aerith removed from the ACC credits if her presence was/is so important?

And yes the world of FFVIi is different than our own. But the most magical thing I see is the magical thinking involved with the ‘Mako Parasite Aerith’ theory.

If Ihink so differently from SE, then I shouldn’t be able to find anything from SE to back up what I’m saying. Yet I wrote over 3000 words to you yesterday using evidence from SE to back up what I said. If I can find that much evidence from SE to back up what I’m saying , then I can’t be thinking so differently from SE.

There is a huge problem with these “statements of fact” from the creators, which is that most of these “statements of fact” are in Japanese. Most of the time, these statements have to be translated into English by non-SE personnel who are most often fan translators. There has been a great deal of argumentation over these translations.

For example, Nojima wrote this in CoL White:

Clerith source

Cloti source

There has been an ongoing debate about the meaning of the word koibito inthat sentence. Clerith people have a great deal of evidence that the word “koibito. ” in that sentence means “lover” Cloti’s  admit that the that the standard meaning of the word “koibito” is “lover”, but they also insist that the word doesn’t have that meaning in this sentence due to verb tense.

My own opinion is that we don’t have an English translation from  SE. Both the Cloti side and the Clerith sidee of this debate about the meaning of “koibito” in CoL White are based on fan translations.

On several occasions, there have been fan translations that got translated by SE afterwards and the SE translation was different than the fan translation. That happened, for example, with this  line from the DoC game manual:

The fam translation is WAY more romantic than the  SE translation. Same thing happened with the use of koibito in Tifa’s profile in the Reunion Files. Cloti had fan translators had translated “koibito” as “lover”  in Tifa’s profile, but SE translated it as “sweetheart”. 

I’m not saying that fan translators are incorrect. I’m saying that SE doesn’t always translate things the way we expect. So I see no point in arguing about it until we have a translation from SE.

===========================

Aw sheesh….I just went back to refer to the part of your post and i see you’ve changed your entire answer - so I’ll have to start all over now.

Cloud’s Only True Love

The woman he longs to meet in his promise land, will never leave his side. 

Their love is eternal and not even death can separate their passion. 

K O I B I T O

1. Aerith gives off a Mother Earth vibe because she saved the Planet from destruction in FFVII. She also healed all citizens of the Planet from Geostigma in AC/ACC using a combination of the Lifestream (the life force of the Planet) plus rain water

2. Aerith has these abilities because she is part Cetra. The Cetra are able to commune with the planet. She is not human.

3. Cloud is also not human. He has been injected with the cells of Jenova and inundated with high levels of Mako (the Lifestream), which affect his perception of the world and gives him superhuman abilities.

4. Cloud’s bond to Aerith is due to the high levels of Mako (Lifestream) in him. Since Aerith is able to commune with the Lifesteram, she is also able to commune with Cloud due to the high levels of Mako in him. Nomura has even said that Aerith lives on inside of Cloud because of this. .Here’s a link to that interview: 

http://i.imgur.com/JGGnu0c.gifv

The following is a screenshot:

That interview can be seen on the Advent Children DVD. It says this:

A detailed explanation can be found in this post: Aerith is Dead…

5. When Nomura says that Aerith lives on inside of Cloud, he means that Cloud and Aerith’s spirits are joined by the Lifestream in an eternal bond as soulmates.  A detailed explanation is in this post: Aerith is Dead….

6. Aerith specifically says in the Maiden Who Travelled the Planet (an official novella released by SE) that Aerith loves Cloud more than Zack:

Aerith was in even greater pain when she thought about Cloud. She also had good feelings towards him. At first, she thought he somehow had some similarities to her first love. Even so, his looks, voice and personality weren’t similar and he also made her think of him as a mysterious person… But it soon didn’t matter. She loved him much more than her first love. Cloud was her hero and he couldn’t get away from danger. She saw him as someone full of confidence, cool and had the impression that he would disappear in an instant if she took her eyes off him. She wanted to stay by his side forever if she could. She really wanted to.

7. Aerith and Zadk being together in the Lifestream means nothing because Jessie, Biggs, and Wedge are also together in the Lifestream and they are just friends.

8. When Cloud says, “I’m not alone… mot anymore” and smiles at the end of AC/AC, he means that he is no longer alone because he has found Aerith again. He has felt alone without her for the last two years, but he no longer feels alone now because he found her again in AC/ACC. This is explained in more detail at the following post:  Aerith is Dead….

Other interpretations are possible, but the Clerith viewpoint is fully backed by quotes from the creators, the gamelore of FFVII and the script of the game.

1. Ok

2. She is human. Humans are just cetra who lost the ability to speak to the planet and all that jazz.

3. Cloud despite being enhanced is still human. I have no clue why you are saying him and Aerith are not human.

4. How is Aerith able to commune with everyone else then? And Aerith does not literally live inside of Cloud. Just stop it. For your own sake.

5. Did you hurt yourself making that logical leap? Nomura says nothing of the sort. And you would think this would be kind of a big deal if Aerith was literally fused to Clouds soul. Strange how the last we see of her she is leaving with Zack. Shouldn’t she be leaping into Cloud?

6. I don’t care about Maiden. Benny does not write the story of FFVII.

7. Why don’t we see them then? Surly ACC could have included them right?

8. Cloud smiled before seeing Aerith AND ZACK. He smiled at the children. He returned a shy smile to Tifa. He was alone for a short time during and before the movie in self imposed exile. You have zero support for this 2 years nonsense.

In fact let’s post that ACC story playback shall we?

Funny how this paints a vividly different picture from the “clerith perspective”.

Cloud surrounded by friends and family forgives himself and he realizes where he is meant to live. And since he is no longer suffering in loneliness Aerith and Zack LEAVE. Nothing in there about “finding Aerith”. Also strange how it’s Aerith AND Zack every time they are mentioned. While Tifa Marlene and Denzel are separated out as his family.

The quote Jeffe posted, there’s an additional line to it that state Aerith and Zack go back to the lifestream. 

There’s several lines that say Zack and Aerith are from the lifestream. Not from within Cloud or back to Cloud.The full thing Nomura is saying is that if we remember someone they are not truly gone, not that Aerith literally is INSIDE of Cloud. 

I have the full interview of the making of Advent Children. It’s not literal of Aerith being inside of him, but rather that those who have died (in general) live on inside of us because we carry their memories. 

Okay, I was in the middle of answering this question when I left off yesterday.  I was still commenting on what Bugenhagen had to say in Como Canyon, so refer back to his dialogue in my last post.

========================

I HAVE TO CLARIFY SOMETHING HERE

Enoigmaphenomenon just messaged me and said that she posted this to Jaffe, not to me. So I am answering the wrong questions - sorry, Eni. I’m going to answer them anyway, though, just to clarify the points I’ve made. Thanks for contacting, me, Eni! *hugs*

Anyway, I think I left off here, talking about Bugenhagen’s comments in Cosmo Canyon (see )my last post for the dialogue)

As I said yesterday:

1. Bugenhagen clearly says that souls roman the Planet and that they are part of the Planet.  He also says that spirits roam, converge, and divide. That means there’s no one place for the spirits to be. The souls are part of the Planet. That means Aerith’s soul can be anywhere she wants to be.

2. Nojima says in CoL White that Aerith is a Cetra and that she chose not to return to the Planet at that time. The Cetra spirts at the Temple of Ancients also told Aerith that they had chosen not to return to the Planet for hundreds of years by their own chioce so that they could guard the Black Materia. Since Aerith is a Cetra, this shows that Aerith is able to choose where her spirit goes.

3. Bugenhagen clearly says that the Lifesteramm is part of life on the Planet and that it exists within nature. Therefore, the Lifestrean can be found within all living things. He also says that spirits roam converge and divide in the Lkfestream, which means that they travel and roam the Planet within the Lfestream. This means that Aerith is able to be anywhere the Lifestream is.

Since Cloud has an extraneous amount of Mako (Lifestream) in him - not only was it infused into him by Hojo, but he received a “double dose” of it while submerged in the Lifestream for about 10 days before resurfacing in Mideel - there is more than enough Lifestream in his body for Aerith’ spirit to reside there. 

4. Notice too that Bugenhagen says there are exceptions:

Bugenhagen         "'Spirit Energy' is a word that you should never forget."         "A new life... children are blessed with Spirit energy and are brought into the world."         "Then, the time comes with they die and once again return to the Planet..."         "Of course there are exceptions, but this is the way of the world."         "I've digressed, but you'll understand better if you watch this." (FMV sequence. The camera zooms in on model Earth. We see trees and humans being born, then die. Their bodies becomes masses of swirling light, then streak across the surface of the Earth, merging. O

If there are exceptions, then you can’t say that Aerith’s spirit and consciousness living inside of Cloud is impossible. It may be impossible on Planet Earth, but the principles of life and death are different on planet Gaia than they are on Earth. After all, Sephiroth was dead thoughout the events of Disk 1, 2, and 3. That couldn’t happen on Earth.

Now, you asked about why we don’t see Aerith ;popping back into Cloud intead of leaving with Zack at the end of the movie:

No that’s not the idea at all. If she is bonded to Cloud’s soul, then that bond will remain wherever Aerith goes. 

Think of it in terms of two people who are in love. Have you ever heard a man or woman say that their heart is always with their love? Does that mean they have to be together for that bond to exist? No. It means their heart is with their love no matter whether they are in the sane location or far apart.

That’s the kind of bond I’m talking about here. Aerith’s heart is with Cloud and Cloud;s heart is with Aerith regardless of whether they are far apart or near one another. Their souls are bonded, so they are always with each other regardless of any physical distance. A bonding of the souls has nothing to do with physical proximity.

In the sane vein, why does Aerith returning to the Lifestrean with Zack ean that she’s in love with Zack? Jessie, Biggs, and Wedge are also in the Lifestream together but they are just friends. The same could be true for Zack and Aerith.

Then why do you believe anything in the Ultimania’s? Maiden Who Travels the Planet was published by SE in the FFVII Ultimania Omega. If you consider other information in that Ultinania to be official, then you have to consider all parts of it to be official. If you find the story published in it to be questionable, then the rest of the information in that book is also questionable.

Besides as i said before, the story and script of FFVII was written as a staff collaboration. It wasn’t written by any single author. Nojima himself said so in the following interview:

So you can’t say that any one staff member was involved in writing the story or script, Multiple staff were involved and it was a collaborative effort.

You mean Cloud and Aerith? IMO, Cloud and Aerith were included in both AC and ACC. If anything, I felt that AC and ACC both were strongly pro-Clerith and pretty much defeated any idea of Cloti. To state it blatantly,I personally felt that both AC and ACC canonized Clerith and I know many other Clerith people who feel the same way.

You see it differently. Fine. Nomura even said in the AC prologue that more than ne interpretation is possible:

Just don’t try to tell me that there’s only one correct way to interpret the movie because Nomura clearly says right here that there is NOT only one way to interpret it.

Now you’er relying on interpretation only. IMO, Cloud didn’t return Tifa’s smile at all. Other Clerith ;people I’ve spoken to don’t see Cloud smile at Tiga, either - her smile to him is more than obvious, but none of us see him smiling at her. This is all we see:

IMO that’s a brush off… not a smile.

Now you say the movie alone imposed exile on Cloud. Again, you’re ibasing your judgments on physical proximity. At the end of the movie Cloud says, 

“I’m not alone…. not anymore”

Whether Cloud’s talking about being alone or feeling alone are two different things. It’s pure interpretation. You say he wasn’t alone while living with Tifa and the kids, but I say he FELT alone without Aerith even while living with Tifa and the kids.

You don’t see it that way because you think Cloud’s in love with Tifa. I don’t think he’s in love with Tifa. I see absolutely ZERO indication of romantic feelings from Cloud to Tifa anywhere in AC or ACC. Neither do other Cleriths. The ONLY romance I see going on in AC/ACC is between Cloud and Aerith.

Clerith people do not see the HW scene as romantic. We never have. The bit about sharing mutual feelings means to us that they shared mutual feelings of strong friendship, and that’s it. That’s backed up by the FACT that the ;picture of the HW scene shown on the FTOIL page is of the next morning, not the night before. Look at the picture:

That’s a picture of the next morning when Tifa asked to rest her head on Cloud’s shoulder a little longer.THAT’s when the mutual feelings are shared without words, Sharing mutual feelings without words does not refer to them having sex. The mutual feelings without words that they shared are the feelings they shared when Tifa rests her head on Cloud’s shoulder a little longer the next morning. That’s what the picture shows on the FTOIL page.

And those feelings are verbalized by Cloud the next morning. He says this:’

Those feelings can be taken both romantically and platonically. So when Nojima says that he knew that Cloud and Tifa would be together in AC/ACC, he’s referring to the mutual feelings they expressed here. Those feelings are not decisively romantic - they can be taken as platonic feelings of close friendship, too.

As for the family Tifa says this in Case of Tifa:

source: FFVII Citadel

So the family does not indicate romance. The family indicates a close friendship.

There is no indication that Cloud and Tifa sleep together. That is left up to the viewer’s imagination. We are never shown that they share a bedroom. Sure, it’s possible that they have sex even if they don’t share a bedroom, but it’s equally possible that they don’t have sex. Once again, it’s left up to the viewer’s imagination.

If you remember, Cid and Shera lived together for years without being romantically involved before and during FFVII. Things changed between them AFTER FFVII, but they lived together for years in the same house before and during FFVII for years with no romantic involvement at all. Jessie, Biggs, Wedge, Tifa, and Barret also lived together for years in the same house with no romantic involvement. Slo living inthe same house does not automatically mean that they are romantically involved.

It’s all up to interpretation, just like Nomura said in the AC prologue..It’s possible to interpret the evidence as Clerith just as easily as it is to interpret the evidence as Cloti.

As I said before I personally see the evidence as pointing to a Clerith romance. IMO, FFVII and AC/ACC are both blatantly Clerith. You see it differently. Fine. I’ve seen all of your evidence and I’m not convinced by it.Your free to have a different opinion, but my own interpretation of the LTD is that Cloud’s true love is Aerith.