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Ja me räjäytämme sinun possessiivisuffiksisi

@possessivesuffix / possessivesuffix.tumblr.com

Historical linguist from Helsinki | Finnish, Finno-Ugric, phonology, typology etc. | tumblr annex of Freelance Reconstruction
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Reading Güldemann's recent ~400-page handbook review on the classification of the languages of Africa; so far seems like fair treatment & in decent detail. Already the introduction has good underlining of basic methodological points like

  • where substantial shared material exists, one should default to a relationship and not propose mass loaning / creolization / "mixing" without further arguments
  • correspondence sets without proper reconstruction can be almost as important for tracing external relationships as fully reconstructed proto-forms
  • not every language has numerals and thus not every relationship involves them either
  • lack of proper documentation is an obstacle for proper classification

Finished reading after a week and a half, and my recommendation stands! A well balanced review: makes the basics of the field clear for newcomers, does not stray into either speculation or "it hasn't been done so it can't be done" skepticism, some minor engagement with primary data like a few key vocabulary items identified as Niger-Congo membership markers, often marks out areas where more work is definitely needed.

The "domains" of Khoisan (13 pages) and Niger-Congo (128 pages) are discussed in the best detail I think. The latter especially makes it clear how, between the various perhaps spurious units, many are only really spurious as subgroups but their members belonging in the family overall still looks likely, e.g. Adamawa, Ubangian.

To throw out one follow-up idea, this also suggests to me interesting new possibilities on the origin of Niger-Congo. The traditional classification of the family "starts" in the west, with Mande, Dogon and Atlantic branching early and splits then proceeds eastwards / clockwise around Gulf of Guinea towards Bantu; if so it would be very mysterious how some really early branches would have ended up in Kordofan instead. However if Mande & Dogon are now excluded and the components of Atlantic cannot be definitely shown to be early splits, and the Adamawa / Ubangi area also abounds in small language groups only weakly established as NC members — maybe it's instead there in the northeast that we have some early-splitting branches, with later areal convergence producing some superficial appearence of large subgroups. And from a homeland somewhere in this direction, it would be then already more reasonable to then find a few other early-diverging branches in Sudan. (Or indeed even further; Güldemann takes even the very speculative concept of "Niger-Saharan" surprizingly seriously and, with full Nilo-Saharan basically obsolete now, there would be in principle openings also there for even more distant relatives to the family. Getting ahead of things here though.)

The treatment of the also large Nilo-Saharan "domain" ends up necessarily less in-depth (75 pp.) due to almost everything about this being still in the air. There are good reviews especially about the state of the large subunits Central Sudanic (solid, needs more reconstruction especially in its eastern end) and Eastern Sudanic (several likely connections in there, the idea fully panning out is not yet a given). Many of the other small units are left basically at mention that they exist and may not be documented too well. (George) Starostin's interesting basic-lexicon survey from some years back gets no mention unfortunately, even though he has many of the same conclusions as Güldemann, and though he does not generally shy away from citing also only preliminarily circulated manuscripts if particularly relevant.

Afroasiatic is also covered in less detail (38 pp.), now for somewhat opposite reasons: it's fairly solidly established and has proportionally lots of specialist literature on the overall family already, so there's less about overall classification to even review. The history of its overall assembly is probably good for context but, unlike in the other cases, maybe doesn't have too much to contribute to understanding the current situation. Finer attention to open questions within Chadic, Cushitic and Omotic would have been nice, but perhaps there is indeed a better place and better writer for those elsewhere.

The title of the paper still is "Historical linguistics and genealogical language classification in Africa" though, and it might have been nice to underline better that former does not end once the latter has been established. Classification clearly takes front seat here and a couple issues of historical linguistics (e.g. any proto-cultural reconstruction, engagement with neighboring disciplines like archeology and genetics) get sidelined entirely. Maybe it's for the better, across a whole continent there would be easily some additional 400 pages to be written on each these!; don't get your hopes too high.

The whopping 83 pages of bibliography lastly seems like a very good starting point for branching more into particular issues, although obviously also this is only the peak of the iceberg.

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Ok like nobody seems to have noticed but Juliette Blevins has recently put out a case that Great Andamanese might actually have been Austroasiatic all along (to complement Jarawan possibly being an Austronesian relative). There's some stuff that's certainly suggestive, but it'll be a bit more work needed before I'm ready to accept these 32 proposed correspondences as anything more than chance, particularly after the Indo-Vasconic debacle. Still, below the cut I'm going to try and give this a fair review.

Even taking both her glosses and reconstructions at face value, the only semantically identical match on the Swadesh list is 'mouth'. If there is anything here apart from sheer chance, it is borrowing and not genetic relationship. But taking Blevins' examples at face value is not a good idea anyway. Unfortunately I have no time now to delve deeper into the data underlying her reconstructions :-(

I know of A Guy who's been doing independent reconstruction of Proto-Great Andamanese; he seems to agree there's parallels with Austroasiatic, especially Munda, and that Great Andamanese should be seen as an independent and newer arrival to the archipelago than Ongan; but also that Blevins' reconstruction kind of sucks and needs to be re-done with better coverage of the data. We'll see what happens after that.

No full linguistic report out yet, but here is a multidisciplinary essay that goes in some part into the issue: The isolation of the Andaman islanders

Call me convinced: by all appearances, the ancestors of the Proto-Great Andamanese speech community were participating in the same maritime network that connected Austroasiatic Pre-Munda speakers in Southeast Asia with the Mahanadi Delta. And the pigs can inform us of the direction the contact was coming from: based on the genetic affinity of the introduced Andamanese wild boar with populations from eastern India, these would have been Munda-speaking seafarers from eastern India, post-maritime migration.

(Plus more! Do read, makes quite a good example of how to combine evidence from multiple disciplines.)

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Reading Güldemann's recent ~400-page handbook review on the classification of the languages of Africa; so far seems like fair treatment & in decent detail. Already the introduction has good underlining of basic methodological points like

  • where substantial shared material exists, one should default to a relationship and not propose mass loaning / creolization / "mixing" without further arguments
  • correspondence sets without proper reconstruction can be almost as important for tracing external relationships as fully reconstructed proto-forms
  • not every language has numerals and thus not every relationship involves them either
  • lack of proper documentation is an obstacle for proper classification
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“The biologist Robin Wall Kimmerer, a member of the Citizen Potawatomi Nation, observes that the indigenous Potawatomi language is rich in verb forms that attribute aliveness to the more-than-human world. The word for “hill,” for example, is a verb: to be a hill. Hills are always in the process of hilling, they are actively being hills. Equipped with this “grammar of animacy,” it is possible to talk about the life of other organisms without either reducing them to an “it” or borrowing concepts traditionally reserved for humans. By contrast, in English, writes Kimmerer, there is no way to recognize the “simple existence of another living being.” If you’re not a human subject, by default you’re an inanimate object: an “it,” a “mere thing.” If you repurpose a human concept to help make sense of the life of a nonhuman organism, you’ve tumbled into the trap of anthropomorphism. Use “it,” and you’ve objectified the organism and fallen into a different kind of trap.”

— Merlin Sheldrake, Entangled Life: How Fungi Make Our Worlds, Change Our Minds & Shape Our Futures

This is what we in the field of linguistics call "nonsense", or a bit more specifically, "exotification".

Just because something is a verb does not mean that it "attributes aliveness", or any kind of activity — nor is there any deep conceptual difference here between English and Potawatomi, as you might notice from the ability in also English to describe hills by all sorts of verbs like "looming", "lying (at)", "rising", "covering (an area)"; then likewise "it" does not imply inanimacy, it is after all routinely used e.g. of any nonhuman animals…

Do the Potawatomi think in general (and not just specifically Kimmerer) that all hills "are actively being hills"? Who knows, perhaps they do, but them simply having a verb meaning 'to be a hill' is neither sufficient nor necessary for that worldview.

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Bonus points if you guessed which language it is :)

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I know how it's pronounced but I don't know offhand which language it is: clearly the equivalent of Devanagari ठ in some Indian script, thus gotta be /ʈʰ/

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Every time I start to think Finnish words aren't that long really, I see something like this:

First word is a simple compound: pörssi 'marketplace' + sähkö 'electricity' + marginaali 'marginal'… The second gets a bit more involved morphologically: kaksi 'two' → kaksin 'twice' (instructive plural); kerta 'time, instance' → kaksinkertainen 'double, two-fold' → kaksinkertaistaa 'to double smth, make double' (transitive) → kaksinkertaistua 'to double' (intransitive) → kaksinkertaistuminen 'doubling' (so-called fourth infinitive)

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holonyymi

Joitakin wanhoja salaisia vaihtoehtoja Suomen Murteiden Sanakirjan mukaan:

  • plätti (yleinen läpi Varsinais-Suomen ja Ala-Satakunnan)
  • lätti (Somero, Humppila, Viljakkala ja Kangasalan…Kurun tienoilla)
  • flätty (Ikaalinen)
  • pletti (Perniö, Muurla)

Lettu näyttää olleen suuressa suosiossa Savossa, löytyy myös Kaakkois-Hämeestä ja Hyvinkäältä. Helsingin puhekieleen se on voinut tulla joko noista jälkimmäisistä, tai sitten suoraan mummoloista, koska muurinpohjaletut on lähtöjään nimen omaan savolainen herkku. Lätty näyttää syntyneen kaistaleella suunnilleen Tampereelta Ouluun, plätty löytyy tästä länteen etenkin Keski- ja Etelä-Pohjanmaalla + Länsi- ja Keski-Uudellamaalla, muita osumia mm. Akaalla, Nakkilassa ja Kemin–Tornion seudulla.

Plettu puuttuu luonnollisesti, koska koko Itä-Suomessa ei ole osattu konsonanttiyhtymiä; letti ehkä siksi puuttuu koska tarkoitti jo hiustyyliä; ja toi pletti oikeastaan ehkä pitäisikin olla [plɛtti], Perniön ja lähiseudun murteissa ä vanhastaan äännettiin ruotsalaisella aksentilla eli suppeampana.

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I wonder how far you could get in German by just applying the sound change rules backward to get the protogermanic form and then forwards to German. I know sound changes are lossy and also there's a lot of non cognate but i bet you could get pretty far

ken hale famously did this with arrernte. he already knew warlpiri so he backderived a little bit (warlpiri is v conservative compared to arrernte) and applied arrernte sound changes and it worked better than he expected

Standard Finnish is almost strictly more conservative-up-to-isomorphism than standard Estonian (i.e. even when Finnish is more innovative, it's usually innovative in a non-lossy way that you can still back-derive Estonian from), and higher-ed Estonian classes in Finland have been pedagogically exploiting this for decades already

you will still have to memorize also 500 awkward-to-subtle false friends and a bunch of grammatical differences, but it works well enough that I can read Estonian quite fine and halfway understand it spoken basically just from having studied enough comparative Finnic + knowing German, which is the main source for noncognate vocabulary

(The keyword if you want to read more about comparative linguistics applied to language learning is "contrastive linguistics", FWIW)

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just found out that the “aust-” bit of “Australia” comes from the Latin auster, “south,” rather than the Germanic ost, “east,” and now I’m sad

I just wanted to ask “is there a Westralia?” and now I’m cursed with this knowledge

is there a borealia

fwiw boreas is from Greek (cf. Hyperborea), the native Latin for 'north' is septentrio which, unlike occidens / auster / oriens, has alas somehow gotten mostly snuffed out even from scientific terminology

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stray thoughts: IPA isn't perfect and has always been phonologico-phonetic in practice. i still see people consider it to be something that can fully represent human phonetics, a belief that i think underlies those diacritic-crazed transcriptions you very often see. that IPA can work fully self-sufficiently and interpreted completely mechanically isn't really a good way of thinking about it

like whoever thought "[ˈkʰʌnt̠ɹ̠̊˔ʷi]" was a good transcription in this case was actually just wrong

yes, but also, it probably is still a reasonable transcription of someone's phonetics and the biggest problem here is instead the pretense that a language variety with millions of speakers has "a" single specific pronunciation. I mean even before getting to anything that requires diacritics, you can easily find people whose Sᴛʀᴜᴛ vowel is closer to "standard" [ɜ] or [ɐ] or [a] or …

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Austronesian kinda fits into the areal typology if you buy the theory of Austronesian roots. The theory that Austronesian don't really have many monosyllables because of the presence of a formative (often meaningless/abstract prefixes) and a root (which carries a broad, often onomoatopoeic connotation) Which creates a bimoraic limitation of stems, which exists in more conservative Austroasiatic languages. Like as I've read in Pacoh, the major syllable must be long, or have an obligatory coda.

Also will fit areal typology if you simply think "SE Asia used to look more typologically-Austronesian some 2–4 millennia ago" :)

(this is just-about-proven for Kradai, has some potentially-archaic examples within "Tibeto-Burman" too, and I've already thought for years that one rather ought to investigate the possibility that the Old Chinese A/B "syllable type" distinction was rather *CaCVC versus *(Ci/u)CVC… about Hmong–Mien I don't know enough alas.)

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Funny how Boas was the first guy to say like "Maybe you were transcribing the same sounds differently, instead of it being evidence of regional speech variations?"

Hmm yes two researchers wrote down "Eegloo" and "Iglu", wonder if it's because the preconceived bias of the researcher's native language/dialect or just two different speakers taken from the same village having vast phonetic differences

…first guy in the Americas maybe; Europe had been already aware of the notion of transcription since what, the early 1800s, put into practice in outright documentary linguistics at least since the mid-century too (lots of people debating other people's transcription practices and occasionally pointing out likely errors e.g. in early grammars of Volga region Uralic languages).

still is weird to me though how it had to wait until Boas for Americanists to catch up with all sorts of basic descriptive practices!

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Janhunen if he wrote about Sumerian: Sumerian belongs to the Euphratic family of languages

Also worth noting: his attitude to subgrouping, and its reception

e.g. Janhunen (2009): "Proto-Uralic—what, where and when?":

vs. Salminen (2023): "On the demography, endangerment and revitalization of the Uralic languages":

(…)

---

There's probably legitimate debate to be had especially on "Mordvinic", as many of the Erzya and Moksha dislike plain "Mordvin" for connotations of lumping them as a single ethnic group; both of "Sa(a)mic and "Samoyedic" also definitely have some regular usage anyway (including me in most of my work thus far)… however I believe the only one out there taking this all the way to "Mariic", "Mansi(i)c", "Khant(y)ic" is indeed Janhunen

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